To be clear - there is almost zero chance she has the same feelings for me. I can tell by her interactions with my posts. Friends only.
And she has a new SO.
Also, we've talked about being crushy, falling hard. She's into psychology. I think she'd totally understand. And respect me for choosing to focus
more on the home fires. It wouldn't be a confession of love, just of some OCDish behavior I felt the need to cut out (yes that she was the center of.)
I feel like I could provide a simple, generic, emotionless rationale. And that would buy my peace. I'd in essence be getting permission to cut her off from everything, except email/text, which I guarantee she wouldn't. (We don't really text at all.)
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As a member, you'll gain access to our members-only forums, where you can:
Engage in meaningful discussions: Read, create, and search all threads and posts, fostering a vibrant community of like-minded individuals.
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Disclosure for Closure?
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
ive just written an updated article on this topic
https://limerence.net/the-desire-to-disclose ... issonance/
as the hyperlinks are not working ive reproduced it below
Even though my limerence happened well over a decade ago, I can remember most of the disclosures I made clearly. There were 6 in total, some face to face, some by email and some in psychotherapy group settings.
The first was 2 weeks into my mania. I went for a coffee with LO and her friend who happened to be in the same small group that we were part of in our therapy training. As far as I was concerned, this was great as it aided my contact with LO. All just part of my own narcissistic manipulation at that time. I had been open in that small group about talking about a current infatuation but not mentioned any name.
Against the advice of Stacey, my therapist, and my wife Ruth, I told LO I had a crush over her. Us limerents are slow learners! It was an embarrassing moment, and I could see I had made LO feel very uncomfortable. Interestingly, her friend had already guessed LO was the object of my infatuation which shows it’s sometimes hard to hide these things.
In my next therapy session, Stacey was pissed at my disclosure. Therapists are supposed to be non-judgemental, however Stacey was not one of these wishy washy “how do you feel” types - which is exactly what I needed from my therapist. She rightly, she pointed out I had no knowledge of LO’s history and levels of trauma, and such a disclosure may make her feel uncomfortable or worse, impact her deeply. At Stacey’s suggestion, I emailed an apology to LO, to which she replied, pretty much rescuing me. So the drama triangle dynamic was set up early on between me, Ruth and LO.
Over the next few months, I was too busy getting my own narcissistic supply from LO to even contemplate any form of withdrawal. We were in several groups together and as LO lived en-route to our training college, I even picked her up from home a couple of times. How’s that for porous boundaries on both our parts! My crush wasn’t mentioned although these was always a tension in the air, well at least from my part. In hindsight (ah yes, that exact science) I would have been better serviced going No Contact then.
Roll forward 9 months. We had had a summer break and after more work on understanding my limerence as an addiction, I finally went No Contact. One point of discussion in therapy was do I tell LO of me going NC. Stacey felt it wasn’t necessary and was just another way for me to get back on the drama triangle.
CUTTING OFF THE FUEL SUPPLY
By going No Contact, we are cutting off the narcissistic supply to our LO’s. Think of narcissistic supply like fuel. Our LO’s have their fuel hoses plugged into us, as we do to them as well. When we go NC, we are ripping off these supply lines. Its why we find going NC so hard, as we are cutting off our own supply in the process. And narcissism and narcissist supply is ALWAYS involved in limerence. We are equally narcissistic as our LO’s, however that for another article.
So, as I had cut off my fuel supply to LO, she was confused and perhaps angry that I was no longer giving her attention. She asked me why was I pulling back from a mutual group we had set up with some other peers. I so wanted to explain why however I heard Stacey’s voice telling me to say nothing. So I gave some evasive reply.
LO brought it up again in a facilitated therapy group we were part of. Again I said I was dealing with personal issues and their was nothing more to be said. I explained to our psychotherapy facilitator after that session of my infatuation and he suggested I maintain the boundary and not to disclose.
In the following week’s group, LO was like a dog without a bone and again brought up the issue of my withdrawal from her. In that moment I got angry at her relentless and flipped from victim on the drama triangle to the position of the persecutor. I told her, in front of 6 other trainee therapists about limerence, explained what it was and how my crush that I had told her about 2 weeks into our training had morphed into something way more unmanageable for me. We discussed this in the group for the best part of an hour before moving on.
And that’s when my first extended period of Low Contact began. Suffice to say, over the next 3.5 years of our training there were a few more disclosures as this disclosure did not abate things.
2 years later, at the suggestion of one of my tutors, I asked LO if she would attend a joint counselling session with me to help me try and work out my projections towards her. She refused which was her right to do so. None of these disclosures helped. They just fuelled the unconscious dance that carried on.
WHY DOES DISCLOSURE NOT WORK?
Limerence is fuelled by the uncertainty created by the barriers to consummation. It’s a natural and normal part of early romantic attraction. Where there are no barriers to consummating the relationship, the uncertainty is gradually replaced with certainty.
Desire is fuelled where attraction meets uncertainty. This last point is well worth noting as its mostly responsible for the dead bedrooms in so many marriages. With limerence, the uncertainty remains, which drives our desire. This conflicts with our belief system of fidelity, assuming we are in a committed monogamous relationship elsewhere and so the limerence gets onto this self-maintaining loop. Its why No Contact is the best way to break the cycle as it allows the uncertainty to dampen down.
By disclosing to our LO’s we are telling them that we are the best and cheapest source of fuel they can currently get. As our LO’s are often at the same level of conscious awareness as us (and when we are first in limerence we are not that conscious despite what you may want to believe) they think great, lots of cheap fuel. And this readily accessible supply is going to give them lots of their own dopamine hits along with their own ego strokes, attention, validation, affirmation, and esteem boosts.
Let me stress, in most cases, our LO’s are not consciously doing this. They are not maliciously setting out to drain us of our fuel (AKA flirting), however, like us they are always looking for cheap easy to source fuel.
Whilst a part of us may be hoping to receive a rejection through our disclosure, this rarely works for 2 reasons. First it’s rare for an LO to understand limerence and the need for them to break all their contact with us as well.
When I’ve worked with clients that have been an LO themselves and explained limerence, they always say they had no idea of how they were playing into the drama triangle and getting their own narcissistic needs met. This often elicits shame within the LO once they see their contribution to the dance.
The other reason it rarely works is, even if we are rejected, which rarely happens because as I said before, the LO is at the same level of consciousness as us, part of our thinking goes, “oh my LO is just being cruel to be kind and still likes me”
The only occasions I would advocate disclosure would be if both parties are available for a relationship where there is no deceit involved with anyone else or if the limerence is towards your therapist.
The latter to give it yet another label, erotic transference, is something well recognised in the client-therapist relationship. That’s for another article.
https://limerence.net/the-desire-to-disclose ... issonance/
as the hyperlinks are not working ive reproduced it below
Even though my limerence happened well over a decade ago, I can remember most of the disclosures I made clearly. There were 6 in total, some face to face, some by email and some in psychotherapy group settings.
The first was 2 weeks into my mania. I went for a coffee with LO and her friend who happened to be in the same small group that we were part of in our therapy training. As far as I was concerned, this was great as it aided my contact with LO. All just part of my own narcissistic manipulation at that time. I had been open in that small group about talking about a current infatuation but not mentioned any name.
Against the advice of Stacey, my therapist, and my wife Ruth, I told LO I had a crush over her. Us limerents are slow learners! It was an embarrassing moment, and I could see I had made LO feel very uncomfortable. Interestingly, her friend had already guessed LO was the object of my infatuation which shows it’s sometimes hard to hide these things.
In my next therapy session, Stacey was pissed at my disclosure. Therapists are supposed to be non-judgemental, however Stacey was not one of these wishy washy “how do you feel” types - which is exactly what I needed from my therapist. She rightly, she pointed out I had no knowledge of LO’s history and levels of trauma, and such a disclosure may make her feel uncomfortable or worse, impact her deeply. At Stacey’s suggestion, I emailed an apology to LO, to which she replied, pretty much rescuing me. So the drama triangle dynamic was set up early on between me, Ruth and LO.
Over the next few months, I was too busy getting my own narcissistic supply from LO to even contemplate any form of withdrawal. We were in several groups together and as LO lived en-route to our training college, I even picked her up from home a couple of times. How’s that for porous boundaries on both our parts! My crush wasn’t mentioned although these was always a tension in the air, well at least from my part. In hindsight (ah yes, that exact science) I would have been better serviced going No Contact then.
Roll forward 9 months. We had had a summer break and after more work on understanding my limerence as an addiction, I finally went No Contact. One point of discussion in therapy was do I tell LO of me going NC. Stacey felt it wasn’t necessary and was just another way for me to get back on the drama triangle.
CUTTING OFF THE FUEL SUPPLY
By going No Contact, we are cutting off the narcissistic supply to our LO’s. Think of narcissistic supply like fuel. Our LO’s have their fuel hoses plugged into us, as we do to them as well. When we go NC, we are ripping off these supply lines. Its why we find going NC so hard, as we are cutting off our own supply in the process. And narcissism and narcissist supply is ALWAYS involved in limerence. We are equally narcissistic as our LO’s, however that for another article.
So, as I had cut off my fuel supply to LO, she was confused and perhaps angry that I was no longer giving her attention. She asked me why was I pulling back from a mutual group we had set up with some other peers. I so wanted to explain why however I heard Stacey’s voice telling me to say nothing. So I gave some evasive reply.
LO brought it up again in a facilitated therapy group we were part of. Again I said I was dealing with personal issues and their was nothing more to be said. I explained to our psychotherapy facilitator after that session of my infatuation and he suggested I maintain the boundary and not to disclose.
In the following week’s group, LO was like a dog without a bone and again brought up the issue of my withdrawal from her. In that moment I got angry at her relentless and flipped from victim on the drama triangle to the position of the persecutor. I told her, in front of 6 other trainee therapists about limerence, explained what it was and how my crush that I had told her about 2 weeks into our training had morphed into something way more unmanageable for me. We discussed this in the group for the best part of an hour before moving on.
And that’s when my first extended period of Low Contact began. Suffice to say, over the next 3.5 years of our training there were a few more disclosures as this disclosure did not abate things.
2 years later, at the suggestion of one of my tutors, I asked LO if she would attend a joint counselling session with me to help me try and work out my projections towards her. She refused which was her right to do so. None of these disclosures helped. They just fuelled the unconscious dance that carried on.
WHY DOES DISCLOSURE NOT WORK?
Limerence is fuelled by the uncertainty created by the barriers to consummation. It’s a natural and normal part of early romantic attraction. Where there are no barriers to consummating the relationship, the uncertainty is gradually replaced with certainty.
Desire is fuelled where attraction meets uncertainty. This last point is well worth noting as its mostly responsible for the dead bedrooms in so many marriages. With limerence, the uncertainty remains, which drives our desire. This conflicts with our belief system of fidelity, assuming we are in a committed monogamous relationship elsewhere and so the limerence gets onto this self-maintaining loop. Its why No Contact is the best way to break the cycle as it allows the uncertainty to dampen down.
By disclosing to our LO’s we are telling them that we are the best and cheapest source of fuel they can currently get. As our LO’s are often at the same level of conscious awareness as us (and when we are first in limerence we are not that conscious despite what you may want to believe) they think great, lots of cheap fuel. And this readily accessible supply is going to give them lots of their own dopamine hits along with their own ego strokes, attention, validation, affirmation, and esteem boosts.
Let me stress, in most cases, our LO’s are not consciously doing this. They are not maliciously setting out to drain us of our fuel (AKA flirting), however, like us they are always looking for cheap easy to source fuel.
Whilst a part of us may be hoping to receive a rejection through our disclosure, this rarely works for 2 reasons. First it’s rare for an LO to understand limerence and the need for them to break all their contact with us as well.
When I’ve worked with clients that have been an LO themselves and explained limerence, they always say they had no idea of how they were playing into the drama triangle and getting their own narcissistic needs met. This often elicits shame within the LO once they see their contribution to the dance.
The other reason it rarely works is, even if we are rejected, which rarely happens because as I said before, the LO is at the same level of consciousness as us, part of our thinking goes, “oh my LO is just being cruel to be kind and still likes me”
The only occasions I would advocate disclosure would be if both parties are available for a relationship where there is no deceit involved with anyone else or if the limerence is towards your therapist.
The latter to give it yet another label, erotic transference, is something well recognised in the client-therapist relationship. That’s for another article.
Purchase the 24 part video series on overcoming limerence - see https://limerence.thinkific.com/courses/healing-limerence
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
Hi Dreamingblue,
One idea has Struck has hinted might be just backing off social media entirely. What is Social Media really giving you? Honestly its pretty terrible, I quit for a while (non limerence reason) and it was pretty great (got sucked back in with a certain group I am part of - fortunately I've so far had the sense to not friend my current LO). You can tell your LO and friends you have decided to do a "Digital Detox" and spend time with family or something. That way she has an explanation and you aren't targeting her. Also you get the plus of actually avoiding social media which could end up being a big positive. Worth a shot.
There is a lot of gold in the article David shared. For me I realize with both of my past LOs and now my current, it was never entirely one sided for sure we were exchanging narcissistic supply. They liked to be liked. Probably what you have going on as well, you both enjoy the flirtation and the ego boost that comes with it just at different levels. She may notice you pull away and react, but ultimately she will get over it, as unlikely our LOs are as addicted to the fuel as we are.
One idea has Struck has hinted might be just backing off social media entirely. What is Social Media really giving you? Honestly its pretty terrible, I quit for a while (non limerence reason) and it was pretty great (got sucked back in with a certain group I am part of - fortunately I've so far had the sense to not friend my current LO). You can tell your LO and friends you have decided to do a "Digital Detox" and spend time with family or something. That way she has an explanation and you aren't targeting her. Also you get the plus of actually avoiding social media which could end up being a big positive. Worth a shot.
There is a lot of gold in the article David shared. For me I realize with both of my past LOs and now my current, it was never entirely one sided for sure we were exchanging narcissistic supply. They liked to be liked. Probably what you have going on as well, you both enjoy the flirtation and the ego boost that comes with it just at different levels. She may notice you pull away and react, but ultimately she will get over it, as unlikely our LOs are as addicted to the fuel as we are.
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
Quoted for truth.selkie354 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:53 pm Hi Dreamingblue,
One idea has Struck has hinted might be just backing off social media entirely. What is Social Media really giving you? Honestly its pretty terrible
You can tell your LO and friends you have decided to do a "Digital Detox" and spend time with family or something.
As far as the second part, you don't have to tell your LO and friends anything. Leaving social media reveals many truths, including who your real friends are. The people who truly care about you will still be around. It's amazing! And now you are fully present for them.
Why we feel we have to explain ourselves to everyone we've ever met is one of those post-limerence "WTF?!?!" things that makes me smile now. I thought that I owed the world an explanation for everything. Ha!! How self-centered of me. Like the world cared.
Walk away and go touch the planet.
Person
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DreamingBlue
- Posts: 224
- Joined: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:33 pm
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
It's a good idea, one I can implement on some of the platforms, but not all. I need to be on their for my line of work. So the dynamite is in my hands.
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
I'm sorry you are still struggling. Imo, the disclosure only pushed me deeper into the abyss. Worst mistake ever. I doubted it could get worse than it was, but I had no idea.
How are you today?
How are you today?
I hope you live a life you’re proud of, and if you’re not, I hope you have the courage to start all over again.
F. Scott Fitzgerald
F. Scott Fitzgerald
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DreamingBlue
- Posts: 224
- Joined: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:33 pm
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
Thanks for checking. Better than Friday or Saturday, when I was lost in my head about the endless thoughts and rumination, the way I was feeling trapped outside my fantasy, knowing it will never happen, resentful of my SO. Endless, looping discomfort.
Today I am more at peace. Perhaps I am in the throes of withdrawal, on my way to peace and a return to self.
Today I am more at peace. Perhaps I am in the throes of withdrawal, on my way to peace and a return to self.
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
Your post has triggered some thinking on how to break our habits.
Ive posted a new thread rather than hijack this one on breaking habits which may be of use
see this link
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=7243
Ive posted a new thread rather than hijack this one on breaking habits which may be of use
see this link
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=7243
Purchase the 24 part video series on overcoming limerence - see https://limerence.thinkific.com/courses/healing-limerence
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DreamingBlue
- Posts: 224
- Joined: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:33 pm
Re: Disclosure for Closure?
The real truth of the matter is that none of this is urgent. My mind wants me to think it is. It really doesn't even matter how many connections or lines of communication to her are open. As long as I don't use them I'm fine.
None of this urgent. Do nothing that has anything to do with her.
None of this urgent. Do nothing that has anything to do with her.
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