Updates on my marriage/LTR

A place to help from being limerent again and how to cope with limerence in future relationships.
AMA210
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by AMA210 »

MrSpock wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:31 pm
Acrobatica wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 4:43 pm because men and women just relate differently.
This is no small detail to the extent that the following book should be a mandatory part of high school education:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_Are_f ... from_Venus
I have read this book and it's a gem. My kind Leo heart gave LO a copy and I shared some of the most helpful parts with DH.
Or have we really grown apart? And want different things? And is that the right basis for leaving a relationship?
I personally believe that NO, that is not the right basis for leaving a relationship. I wrote a lot about this in many different posts, mostly in response to AMA's updates, so I won't repeat all the arguments here. But I'll outline the general ideas.
i was hoping for a response from you on this topic, Mr. Spock. Your posts were always very helpful to me.

My basic rule of thumb is that the only reason to break up is when two people just don't care for each other anymore. Or at least one of them doesn't. Granted, figuring out that this is the case might not be easy. For example, someone watching TV all day cares for you? who knows... that behavior is not the place to read it. It could be a signal of disinterest, but it could be just an addictive and even destructive bad habit. God might work in mysterious ways, but we work in irrational ways, most of the time, so is incredibly imprecise to read out intentions and stances from behavior.
Agreed. I do care about DH, but I have fully realized, and have been this way for the past 7 months, that I am not in love with him and the desire for him and to be with him has left the building. I told him this because it's the truth and pretending just wasn't working anymore

Why is that the only reason? because we're all fucked up. If not pissing each other would be the condition to sustain a LTR, we would all be extinct by now.
Amen
And here's something interesting, we actually do usually think that the perfect partner is the one with whom to live happily ever after, as if that were possible. Well, is not.. it would be if we were not humans but perfect defect-less angels.
So, how is that we are not extinct? because evolution rules. As it turns out, we are so unprepared to really understand what it takes to engage with another person, that nature had to invent infatuation. This incredible but powerful brain fabrication involving blind idealization of that other person, uncontrollable desire to physically connect, and the illusion that we need her/him; all of which is vapor-ware crafted so we can procreate. Yes, all about survival of the species.

How do we sustain a LTR then? by understanding what it really involves: learning to share life with another fucked up person.
I simply love this. Every one of us has issues--not just here--but everywhere. Some of the more interesting things about the LO is that some of the time, there is no physical intimacy--the desire and attraction is there, but it's not acted upon, which removes the sole purpose of limerence to be procreation. Honestly, I never looked past his face for almost a year. I am usually not like that. When talking to him, I was oblivious to that "part" of him.
Angles feel free to leave the room and claim you deserve better :). The rest of us, we get what we deserve.

But then, if any LTR is necessarily conflictive because it involves real defective human beings, how, or when, or where are we supposed to be happy? (I also wrote about this in my other posts)
We either have to be happy alone or be in a LTR because society expects it and get the happy from within.
Some might choose to just jump from infatuation to infatuation, secretly knowing that the grass is never really greener on the other side, but feels just like it for a while.
Some other might choose to avoid LTRs if there really is no "happily ever after" in the end.

A problem I see with those alternatives is that getting what we want will only give us pleasure, but never happiness. Happiness comes from loving, and love is to give, not to get.

---

Having said all that, I don't want AMA to think I consider the divorce a mistake. It would be if they really still care for each other, such that it makes the growing process of sharing a life with another person (which is what A LTR ultimately is, a process) worth the pain (which is inevitable in every other growing process), just like, for instance, sharing our lives with a naturally troubled teenager usually is. But I couldn't know that, so it would be a misinformed opinion. I'm merely stating my general views on how things should be IMO.

I do think that Spinnaker advice of turning the "divorce" itself into a process, or rather, putting a sensible deadline into the process of either reconstructing or dropping the marriage, is an excellent idea. In my experience, changes materialize from words into actions when there are clear, nonnegotiable consequences laid down in the concrete future.
[/quote]
Never give up! Keep moving forward, no matter what.
MrSpock
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by MrSpock »

AMA210 wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:13 pm I personally believe that NO, that is not the right basis for leaving a relationship. I wrote a lot about this in many different posts, mostly in response to AMA's updates, so I won't repeat all the arguments here. But I'll outline the general ideas.
i was hoping for a response from you on this topic, Mr. Spock. Your posts were always very helpful to me.
Always glad to help.

One of my favourite jokes is: "I never make the same mistake twice... at least a dozen times! otherwise, how would I learn from it".
Is good to see that having fucked up so many times is finally worth something :)
AMA210 wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:13 pm Agreed. I do care about DH, but I have fully realized, and have been this way for the past 7 months, that I am not in love with him and the desire for him and to be with him has left the building. I told him this because it's the truth and pretending just wasn't working anymore
Sad as it is, when something is broken, it needs fixing. Is good that you figured that out and can move on (and out)
AMA210 wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:13 pm We either have to be happy alone or be in a LTR because society expects it and get the happy from within.
Exactly! Happiness comes from within.

Now... what does that really mean?

For sure it does NOT mean that other people makes us happy. If that were the case, it wouldn't come from within.

But, does it mean we can be happy being completely all alone? [I already wrote a lot here about this but I'll repeat the main idea]

In my not so humble opinion, no, it doesn't. Retiring to an unknown cave to meditate our way to enlightenment in completely isolation is the flip side of co-dependency, and is just as wrong.

What happens is that we do need each other, because it is what we do together that values the most (or the only thing that really matters, but I won't go that far for the sake of the argument). But in order to do things together we ought to be together, and to be together we have to get along, and to do that we have to put up with each other, understand each other, forgive each other.. which in another words is: we need to love each other. Happiness does come from within and is not something that can be taken nor given, because it is the awareness of love, the awareness of being (doing something) together.

Now, what I said above is a general statement about love and happiness, and is not restricted to the special case of a romantic relationship. Therefore, we can find ourselves without such a form of relationship, and be OK, because that does not mean we are alone... it just means we love through other forms of relationship.
AMA210
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by AMA210 »

DH has agreed to begin the paperwork for joint filing.
Unfortunately, he has given up the fight long ago, stating he didn't know how to handle it.
There has been no action to back up his words of love.
This makes me very sad that he hasn't stepped up and found a way to fight to keep his wife.
In a way, it makes me feel that I am not worth fighting for, but I know that is not true.

He and daughter were gone for 2 days and I enjoyed it.....no tv on, reading, writing, freedoms, no questions, no prying, no BS. When they got home, the codep behaviors continued for both of them.

Onwards.....
Never give up! Keep moving forward, no matter what.
Ivanhoe
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by Ivanhoe »

AMA210 wrote: Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:21 pm
In a way, it makes me feel that I am not worth fighting for, but I know that is not true...

Onwards.....
Yes, the only thing to do is keep growing! His codependency is not you. My thoughts: be prepared for some nights of despair - but they will definitely pass. You will get through this!
:ymhug:
65 (feel 50); Male

"Grief makes children of us all. Any intellectual difference is destroyed. The wisest know nothing."
- Emerson
Acrobatica
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by Acrobatica »

Sending you hugs. This is not about whether you are worth fighting for. That is still looking at it from his perspective. This is about whether you are worth it to you to fight for yourself. :ymhug:
Anna
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by Anna »

When I decided it's time for me to split up and divorce, my husband didn't fight for me. Because we both knew it had been over a long time ago... The paper filing was just the formality of something that happened before. And from your reports on here, it has been over for a while as well, so he knows.
AMA210
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by AMA210 »

Anna wrote: Sat Jul 07, 2018 9:03 pm When I decided it's time for me to split up and divorce, my husband didn't fight for me. Because we both knew it had been over a long time ago... The paper filing was just the formality of something that happened before. And from your reports on here, it has been over for a while as well, so he knows.
Thanks for sharing.
Never give up! Keep moving forward, no matter what.
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by Spinnaker »

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Last edited by Spinnaker on Sun Jul 07, 2019 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes.”
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by L-F »

AMA210 wrote: Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:21 pm
In a way, it makes me feel that I am not worth fighting for, but I know that is not true.
Damn right its not true! You are worth more!
Wishing you all the best in your journey.

May life bring you all the riches in the world. May your days be filled with peace. May your heart sing once again. LF

:ymhug:
"LF, why do you weep for the inner child of your abusers?"
"Because I'm not like them."
AMA210
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Re: Updates on my marriage/LTR

Post by AMA210 »

Thank you all for the encouragement. Much appreciated.

I talked to DH yesterday about this lack of fighting for me, so that I could understand where he was coming from, So, the past two years, he didn't know how to fight and admitted he was depressed and in a funk. With this recent development, he hasn't tried to win me back because it won't work anyway. Why try when it will just fail anyway? He mentioned that he was going to buy some nice flowers, but figured it was a waste of money because I wouldn't appreciate it anyway. :-o

His transformation in the past month will never catch up to the level I am at. He views limerence as something that happened, something that needed to be worked out, and then it ends and you go back to your life.

I realized from this that I made the right decision in moving on. :)
Never give up! Keep moving forward, no matter what.
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