David is right that figuring out why we are triggered by criticism is an opportunity for growth and self-reflection. People can be open and brutally honest here without worrying about social graces. I really don't believe that anyone is out to troll anyone when giving advice on this forum! Especially when you read people's post history ----- seeing that they suffered through all of the same emotions and stages of grief then emerged on the other side! Those that have gotten over it are the ones that give the best advice, but they usually don't stick around. Probably because most people here are still in the height, and just want to bask in their limerent high and/or use the forum for catharsis, which I totally get.
If you don't like what someone says in response to your request for advice, just don't respond in the moment. Isn't that the advice with limerence too? Walk away from a toxic situation and don't engage? But take time, cool down, and learn from it? Reflect on it?
Bottom line is you're never going to change anyone, but you can stop trying to change them. And you can choose to walk away. The only thing you can do is protect yourself.
That said, people should generally endeavor to be respectful on this board. But, if you ask for advice, you should also be prepared to accept hearing something you may not necessarily want to hear. Because the truth is sometimes ugly and brutal. We are all flawed in one way or another.
David, I want to personally thank you for what you do. The site is like a lifeboat in a stormy sea, even with the sharks circling
I want to point out that I did not ask for advice when L-F insulted me and wished me physical harm. I was sharing with a new user what worked for me.
Nor were others necessarily asking for advice.
I am asking for a minimal standard of decency. I understand I have no control of this forum, but I would like those who come here to see the view of someone who has been using this forum for over three years.
I also want others to understand that in a forum that is dedicated to mental health issues, that the forum moderator has no interest in calling out clear insults and trolling behavior that the same member promulgates repeatedly.
I also want others to see that this is what happens when a person starts to heal. They begin to stand up for themselves.
I have admin'd several discussion forums since the early 2000s, and this has always been the conventional wisdom and sound policy.
1 warning, then 1 permanent ban, done.
Strong people forgive.
Intelligent people ignore.
Those asking me to intervene want me to rescue. Limerence is all about being on the drama Triangle.
The only way to get off the drama Triangle is to not engage. To those that choose to remain on the drama Triangle it will feel like you are being persecuted by the person who is not engaging.
It may feel to some of you that my refusal to intervene in this is persecutory. I can assure you it is not because I’m doing this consciously and I’m choosing not to get engaged or caught up in this drama Triangle that is playing out on this thread right here right now.
As I keep reiterating you all have a choice as to whether you get caught up in this. The easiest way to stop feeling persecuted by anybody on this forum is not to reply to them, Add that person as a foe so their posts do not appear and if you are really badly triggered maybe sometime away from here would be sensible.
I shall not be replying any more to this thread or request to start moderating more intensively. If you feel a post is violating our forum guidelines, not somebody else’s forum guidelines then submit it for moderation
In order, many of us were raised by PDs.
Many people have nowhere else to discuss these issues.
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Fair enough. It's your forum, and your time and effort.
The forum guidelines contain this (underline is mine):
But then it also says:Limerence.net is an open forum that believes all views are acceptable as long as the following guidelines are kept to. This is a forum that is moderated with a light touch. Posts not adhering to the guidelines will be removed. Repeated offenders will be barred from using this site.
That is why, combining the two, so many of us assumed "harsh or judgmental" posts would be moderated as stated previously.Suffering from limerence can be difficult, and sometimes other posters may say or do things that you don’t approve of. We are all coming from different stages, situations, and backgrounds. Please be considerate and non-judgmental about how others live their lives. If you respond harshly or judgmentally, you will make it harder for others to post for fear of being judged.
I can see that this is not the case from your responses.
In my strong opinion, you should clarify that. Maybe complete that paragraph clarifying that "However, responding in that way will not be considered a violation of the guidelines because <......>".
Theatre directors advise young actors to never take reviews personally; use anything that is useful for growth and ignore anything that seems wrong. That seems like a good way to deal with this forum as well. That said, I did feel L-F's was a personal attack. We've all been victims of our own limerence, which is why we're here, and I would bet that limerence has driven us all to behaviours we regret. It helps no-one to attack people on that basis.
Back when I used to moderate a board in the early 2000s, we'd moderate conflict fairly heavily because it didn't help with the aim of the board. We were mindful of the fact that there are several effects at play, mainly the internet disinhibition effect which leads to things being written which would never be said face-to-face, and a crowd amplification effect which leads to the pile on which you see on twitter and Facebook. These can be overwhelming for the recipient and in the worst cases can lead to self harm or worse, so it does need to be taken seriously whether the aggrieved person is in the wrong or not. We have two people who might feel piled on in this thread.
Anyway. Here was what I wrote. The main point was, it doesn't matter whether you believe the guy in question is clinically narcissistic or not. The practical solution is pretty much the same.
I have to say, L-F, that this was a very pointed personal attack. Rather than addressing a difference of opinion (to wit, that the OP has an issue to deal with as opposed to being the victim of a narcissist), your answer finds personal fault with Acrobatica. This is completely unfair and in addition unhelpful to the OP.L-F wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:19 pm Acro - Well I know a 45 year old married woman throwing herself at a 24year old young man, using tears (emotional manipulation) to try and get him to love her IS abuse. More so when he said he couldn't AND had a girlfriend.
If someone of that age did that to my son I'd go to her and tell her to grow up, and I'd certainly feel like, although I wouldn't, punching her in the face.
Plus, they are David's theories, who happens to be a Licensed Psychotherapist and not some psychology pop-culture believer.
Let's assume Narcissism as a personality disorder exists, even if it is not quite as simple as defined in online forums like Quora. It is impossible and unethical to diagnose anyone definitively with any disorder outside of a clinical setting. By the same token, it's just as unethical to make the sort of implied accusation of Acrobatica as you have here. So where does that leave us? We can say that the OP's LO has displayed some potentially narcissistic traits. We know that OP is probably also limerent. But there is a lot that we don't and can't know on an online forum. We *do* know that OP is in distress, otherwise she wouldn't be here.
So what's the solution? If the guy is NPD or shows narcissist traits, and OP is limerent & in distress, it's best she move on and heal. If he is merely reacting to mixed signals but she is in distress, it's best she move on and heal. If he's dicking her about with mixed signals, it's best she move on and heal. If it's just that the relationship brings pain, it's best she move on and heal.
What I'm saying here is that it doesn't matter whether the guy is manipulative deliberately or it's an interaction between her needs and his, or entirely her projection, it's painful to her and therefore we reach the same conclusion. Unless she feels the relationship to be worth pursuing, whether it's her issue, his or a combination, if it's only going to bring pain, then she needs to go NC or LC. All roads lead to Rome.